Christina and Leilani: Mother and Daughter
Christina and Leilani are second- and third-generation Palestinians in the diaspora. Christina is Leilani’s mother. Due to safety concerns, they would prefer that their names not be shared, and as such the names Christina and Leilani are aliases and their testimonies will be published in transcribed form. Christina has lived her entire life in Peru, and Leilani has lived in Peru and in England. So, their experiences being Palestinian in the diaspora are both similar and different. Christina and Leilani were interviewed in June, 2024, after I interviewed the Nakba Generation. They patiently sat through these other interviews, helping with translation and reframing questions when needed. This took the majority of the day. I cannot thank them enough for all their help, as well as for sharing their own testimonies. The following interview was conducted entirely in English. I hope you enjoy. -Lauren
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Okay, what are your names?
My name is Christina [last name]
And my name is Leilani [last name]
And what are your connections to Palestine?
Because my dad was born in Bethlehem—Beit Jala. It's a town near Bethlehem.
Yes, my grandfather was born in Beit Jala.
And you've maintained your connections to Palestine over the years?
We have family there, living there. Aunts, cousins, no? They're still living in the West Bank. And in Jerusalem.
And have you been?
I've been once in 1981. I went with my mom. And it was a very special experience for me. We came to Tel Aviv, no? And one of my cousins went to pick us up at the airport. So he welcomed us. And he told me, "so finally you came to see your roots." That's what he said. Very emotional. And so we went to Jerusalem. We traveled a lot. We went to, no, I don't know, to the North, to the South—everywhere. But when I left, I was really sad because of the occupation. You could feel that the people were occupied by the army. The soldiers were everywhere. And that was 1981.
And when you were growing up, did your dad tell you about the occupation?
Yes, yes. We always were in contact with the family and hearing a lot of stories about what was happening at the moment: different wars or events that happened during all those years. This last one, I think it's the cruelest, the cruelest. The worst. That's what I think. But you can see that people are waking up, they are realizing what has been happening during all those years in that area. Because maybe before, the media didn't say anything about it, no? All the voices were shut down; the Palestinian voices were silenced. You could not hear the Palestinian voices. Now it's different. Today everybody is getting involved and they want to know more about what is happening. They want to inform themselves of this conflict. Something is changing.
What do you think, Leilani?
Me? Well, I haven't been to Palestine, but through my family over the years I've always been aware of what was happening. And, I always thought it was unfair and I was never in favor of what Israelis were doing. But these last events have really made me very angry. Because I found it so unfair that people can just start bombarding innocent civilians, do whatever they want and no one is doing anything about it; no one is doing anythig to stop it. And it really put me really against Zionism, just in general. And also what really bothered me is because I've been following it very closely on social media. And I've been very aware of the censoring that's been happening in social media. So for example, sometimes I would share posts which wasn't even like insulting anyone or anything; it was just showing a Palestinian being shot or something like that. And then I would get shadow banned or it would be removed from my profile. And that just made me realize that like, it's not only dangerous to Palestine but I actually think it is dangerous for the world.
I think that probably if Zionism didn't exist, I do think that relations between the US and the Arab world would have been totally different. So I, for example, I do believe that Zionists use money to try and make the US be on their side by kind of fomenting like Islamophobia making Americans think they that they need Israel to have good relations with the Middle East. Obviously, America is interested in the Middle East because it has oil, etc. But I feel that, for example, if there wouldn't have been a Zionist state, probably the relations between the US and the Middle East would have been much more smooth. And that perhaps you wouldn't have had so many wars and stuff like that.
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And do you think more people in your generation are coming around to that idea?
I think they are, from what I've seen on my social media. Because, also, I lived in London for a while, and I've been in contact with people from different nationalities. And I do feel that in general, people from the Arab world, so if they're Syrian, Jordanian, even from Iran, all those areas, not just Palestine, they tend to post quite a bit about Palestine and what's going on. Same for people, a bit more like people from Asia, so from Singapore. But I don't tend to see as many people from Western countries being so active about Palestine. And out of the people that are born and raised in London, the ones who have been more proactive about sharing things are normally people with Asian heritage. So I feel like people in Western countries have been much more brainwashed. And they've been brainwashed to feel that if you say anything against the Zionists, you're being anti-Semitic. But obviously, there are Jews who are not supporting what's happening. But the Zionists, it's like you cannot say anything against them, or do any criticism against them without being labeled anti-Semitic. I don't know. I think it's really manipulative and I just really don't like it at all.
Do you guys talk about it with your friends?
With my friends in Peru, well, I talk to some of them. With my friends in London, with some of them, like the ones that are more interested. I post, anyway, and some of them respond. Some of them have been — for example, friends that are from Germany — have been like really shocked that this was happening and they didn't know anything about it. They told me that they were ashamed of their government. So I think a lot of them have like very limited exposure. In general like media in the Western world has been, you know, favoring Israel, especially traditional media.
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Have you received any negative comments on your posts or backlash?
No, I don't. The only thing I would say is that maybe at some point I had a couple of Jewish people that were following me on Instagram and then they unfollowed me and I unfollowed them as well because they were posting some Zionist stuff. But other than that, no, I wouldn't say I received any backlash.
So, Christina, do you talk about it with your friends?
Yes. A lot of them, they want to know what is happening, what has been happening. They're interested in knowing about this and they are really shocked, you know, at what they've been watching. They are very shocked.
So, obviously, this has been going on for 75 years and you guys have known about it for your entire lives.
Yes.
How do you keep paying attention to it when it’s very painful to watch?
We have to see what is happening to inform as many people as we can. We have to know about the facts, no? The truth. We just want the truth to be said. We are not telling lies. We just want the truth to be heard. That's all.
I was talking to [relative] and she thinks maybe because the family has had to move so much, she's gotten very good at assimilating to new places. Do you feel that sort of perpetual migrant vibe?
You know, yeah, so we have a big difference from the other Peruvians right now. The fact is that I feel I'm both. I feel that I'm Peruvian and I'm Palestinian, that I love both sides. Two different cultures in me, no? I feel represented by both.
Even for me, I also feel a bit European, in addition to feeling Peruvian and Palestinian, because I have a lot of European friends and I've lived basically all my adulthood in Europe. And there isn't any conflict there for me. Because I know that, for example, most of the people in Europe don't want this to be happening, it's more like the governments do not represent the people.
So, even though Israel’s goal is to make the Palestinian people leave and lose their connection to Palestine, you haven't lost the connection?
No, not at all.
No. For me, for example, growing up, I was always aware of what was happening. And then also we would have a lot of cultural things.
We maintain our culture.
Yeah.
That’s the difference.
The food and the special days, especially the food, make me feel really connected [to Palestine].
There are a lot of different things that we celebrate. The family is connected too, because we are Christians. That is a connection also.
I’m different. I'm agnostic. So to be honest, that's the thing. I don't really care about a person's religion. In London, I've had friends with different religions. But what bothers me is people's attitudes. So like, for example, like, I wouldn't reject a Zionist Jew because they're a Jew. I reject them because they're a Zionist. So my problem is more about their behavior than their religion.
Yeah, who cares? Everybody has to be happy with the religion they are, no? If you want to be Muslim, fine. If you want to be Jew, fine. But you have to respect the other. Respect the other religion. That's the point. And I think really the solution is one state: a democratic state, and the three religions together like families, without borders in the middle like it was before 1948. Before 1948, there were three religions living together no problem. And that has to be the final goal, you know?
And why do you think creating another border —a two-state solution—won't work?
I think even if they declare like a two-state solution, I still think that the Zionists will still be trying to control everything they can and even if it's not explicit, they will still be doing it in the background.
Israel is a Zionist state. They are fascists. They will they will keep on doing what they have been doing if there Is two states. But, if you create one democratic state for everyone, you dismantle that entity — that Zionist entity. The one that is creating the problem. So, everybody has a right to vote; they will negotiate that way. It would be different, totally different. That's what I think.
The problem is that I honestly don't think that the Israelis will ever sit down to a negotiating table and be fair about it. I think, unfortunately, it will require force. The other thing I would want to say is that if they were to have a one-state solution, initially it’s obviously going to be very tense. You would need to have a foreign army or something keeping the peace for a while until things calm down a bit and then maybe in the longer term, it would work.
Yes. You know, if people begin to see that they can live in peace, that they can have equal rights, all the extremists will begin to leave or change. I think so. But if you keep them separated that won't happen because they'll keep only talking to themselves.
Maybe then there wouldn't be as much resentment?
Exactly.
When I was interviewing [relative], she said being Palestinian has made her have more empathy and connection with her Muslim friends or just Muslim people in general. Do you think that that's true for you?
Sometimes I hear some people say "oh, the Muslims, oh the Muslims," [complaining]. Some Christians — I hear some Catholics and Christians talking like that. It really bothers me. And I always tell them: “You know that your Christian sites are being guarded by those Muslims, my darling. Your Christian sites, in Jerusalem, in Bethlehem, are being protected by the Muslims against the Zionists that want to destroy everything.”
Also, I think that there is like extremists in every religion. But, Hollywood, because it's very like, Zionist-owned, has made a lot of films where there are terrorists and they are always Muslim. But if you think about like, the settlers in Israel, they're terrorists. They're extremists. And like for Christians: there are also groups of extremist Christians. So you cannot really kind of, you know, generalize about who the terrorists are. It’s wrong.
When you talk to people about Palestine, are you open about being Palestinian yourself always?
Yes. When they ask me: "And you're your surname, what is it? Where are you from?" I say: "Palestine." You know before, when I was younger, when they asked me, "[last name], where does it come from?," all we said was Arab. We said "It's an Arabic surname."Now I don't say that. I say "It's Palestinian." That's the difference for me.
For me, I think the only time where I don't say — where I remove my second surname — is when I'm job hunting. But that's also because I know how Zionists are. So from what I've seen, especially at universities in the US, when people are like showing solidarity for Palestine, these Zionists, who should have their heads somewhere else, are messing with the students and their futures. I find that very abusive and just wrong. So I know these people are very — they're very cunning and like I wouldn't want to kind of put myself in a vulnerable position, do you know what I mean?
Yeah. If you're working somewhere and you have the job, do you feel comfortable talking about it like in the workplace or no?
It depends; with some people I probably would, with others I probably wouldn't.
Is there anything that you want to say to the world? To the US, Israel?
I would like to say that I think maybe the next generation will be more aware of the problem and will fight to be fair. I hope that they will not engage in this problem with so many wars. I think, the young people, they don't want wars.
For me, I think that like young Americans especially, should really try and get rid of the Zionist hold on politics. You should not be okay with the Zionists owning the US government, because I feel like it ends up not really being a democracy, if people are just making decisions for their own benefit and not for the general benefit, for the greater good So that's one way that I feel like Zionism should be dismantled, in my opinion. Yeah. And I also would tell them that maybe they should rethink the idea that the US needs Israel, because I actually think it's costing them much more than it's giving them. I think it's more like a liability than a benefit to be so closely allied to—
to an apartheid state, yeah. Yeah.
And do you have hope that the international justice system will do something?
Not really.
Not really, yeah. You know, once my dad told me: "We are alone. We Palestinians are alone. We have to liberate our country by ourselves." That's what he told us. Because we knew that the other Arab countries and all the rest, they don't...help a lot. You can see that.
Do you think that’s changing at all now?
Maybe. It's time for them to change, I think.
Yeah, I think it is changing, with the younger generations. But, there are still many years to go until these generations get into power. And I think that also gives Zionists time to try and machinate another plan — to try and like you know take people on their side and things.
Is there anything that you want to encourage people to do really aren’t involved or who maybe haven't done anything tangible?
I would suggest that they should support the BDS.
Yeah. Don't buy goods from those from companies that like support the settlers and the weapons. You can do that. Don't buy goods from them. It's very easy. You don't have to do much. I started doing it; we saw the list and I was buying a lot of those things and now I’m not going to buy them at all.
Yeah, for example. I used to buy a lot of clothing from Zara. But then, when I saw that advert that looked like the body bags—
Terrible!
And then and then I looked into it and actually the head designer was an Israeli so I was like: "Okay, this is not a coincidence"
No, not at all.
And then I thought that's a lack of respect. I thought it was terrible. And I would have kept shopping in Zara, if she had been fired, but when I went and looked, nothing happened and she's still there. So I will never shop Zara again. I still wear some clothes because they are clothes that I bought before, but other than that, I haven't bought anything new from them since that happened.
Same with Coca Cola. McDonald's. We don't do McDonald's. For example, instead here, we can go to Bembos instead of going to McDonald's. Bembos is Peruvian owned.
I think in general, just go for the Peruvian products. Try and support independent brands, because they tend more to just be people who want to follow their dreams and don't have big political agendas, whereas I think these bigger companies, they could be more involved in these kinds of shady things.
That’s great. Are there any last words you want to share?
Free Palestine.
Free Palestine. That’s it.
That’s it.